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A very fair question regarding my last blog entry, -I'm still having academic fun sharing my views. Quoting Rich1937: Proverbs 3:34 He mocks proud mockers but shows favor to the humble and oppressed. ESv 2 Timothy 3:16 English Standard Version (ESV) All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, I think you'll find this covers some salient points that have been raised. Those who have violated God's law have already been sentenced and are dead in their trespasses and sins and if they do not confess and repent (turn away from) their sins they will pay for them in Satan's company for eternity My response: Hi Rich! Thanks for your citations! As to the first, thanks for your support and I agree with it, but I hope you agree that there's no need for us to go into it further. And the second one I'm very familiar with! It's the most often cited verse to contend with my viewpoint that one is free to pick and choose from the Bible. I too viewed this verse as definitive and final, until I started studying some of the ancient texts, and considered the time frame in which Paul was writing a letter of advice to his young disciple and friend Timothy. (Also bear in mind that in other writings of Paul, he admitted that even he himself did not possess perfect and total understanding. I.e.: 1 Cor 13:12, where Paul admits that his understanding is akin to peering "through a glass darkly.") Before I start, PLEASE remember that I'm only sharing MY views, and I will never criticize anyone who doesn't see things the way I do! I' ve been asked if my faith fits well with most mainstream Christianity, and I have to assert a resounding NO! I'm in such a minority on this topic, that I'd be an arrogant fool to insist everyone agree with me! (LOL! I may re-post this one into a new blog entry too!) Know that Paul was writing this several decades after Christ. At that time, there was no Bible, There was only the Torah, (Old Testament) and with the possible exception of the Gospel of Mark, little had been written down regarding the life and times of Jesus, and what had been written was not universally accepted. That leaves open the question of just what Paul meant when he used the term "scripture". If one assumes that the term refers only to those writings accepted by the Church as canon, then Paul was referring only to the Old Testament, because it was all they had. But note that the first word in the sentence is "ALL", rather than "some". So if Paul was using the term loosely (as one may argue because neither the original Koine Greek, nor the later translations identified that word in the sentence as a proper noun,) then one may interpret Paul to consider as many ancient peoples did, the ability to make permanent and convey a message to a later audience as somewhat mystical and thus metaphorically the "breath of God". -In which case then any writing, even a shopping list for example might qualify as "scripture". Again alternatively, he may have intended it to mean any writings of a Judeo-Christian religious nature, whether canonized or not. And the term "all" is further confounding because in addition to Paul's group "Orthodoxy" there were different writings from several other active sects of followers of Jesus Christ. Some stood in sharp opposition to Orthodox views. -Most notably the "Gnostics". They too had some writings which they based their interpretation and faith in Christ upon. Was Paul including these writings too? So, we can't be certain just what Paul meant by the term "scripture". Finally, note that Paul does NOT say "All scripture is perfect and correct". He may have acknowledged them as a gift from God, but some of them may have been writings to demonstrate common errors and pitfalls. That would still apply to writings that were "profitable for teaching, reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness". And remembering Paul's admission that he saw "through a glass darkly", then perhaps it's possible that he merely over-generalized the term "scripture" to call it "God breathed" as opposed to "God inspired" or some other metaphor. Now, I realize all this taken together appears that I am grasping at straws to back up my view. But we need to back up in the same letter, of Paul's to comments he made prior to verse 3:16. In chapter 2, verse 15 Paul writes: "Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth." (KJV) If (no matter how likely or unlikely) Paul was claiming that the Bible (or scripture) was perfect, just what does one "divide" out of the "word of truth?" I'm disinclined to assume here that Paul meant truth is relative, so if there is only one truth, what should young Timothy divide it from? "Truth from other truth" is a possibility in order to clarify things for total and accurate grasps of concepts, but still that implies that it's entirely possible to read passages and derive "untruth" from them. To me, that doesn't speak affirmatively about a "perfect" scripture. So, after all that, I still have to admit that my view is a subjective one, and therefore I would never criticize anyone who politely disagrees with me! But thanks for creating another opportunity for me to share my views! GBU, Gavin |
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If I may just comment, God is all merciful and he who repents, even at the last breath, will be forgiven and go to Heaven.
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What an interesting blog Gavin!!
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If I may just comment, God is all merciful and he who repents, even at the last breath, will be forgiven and go to Heaven. GBU, Gavin
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TY Rocket, Grace, and Mott! GBU, Gavin
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TY Leaf! GBU, Gavin
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Thanks Rich! I appreciate your concern, but I'm not worried! (If I'm wrong on any of these things, I'm pretty sure God is gonna forgive me.) And I'm sorry if it appeared I was trying to initiate a debate! I mentioned that I don't insist anyone agree with me, but perhaps I should have better emphasized that I don't object to, or criticize anyone who disagrees with me. Thanks again for a nice blog experience, and GBU! Gavin
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